Leadership Lessons From The Great Books

Hello. My name is Jesan Sorrells, and this is the

Leadership Lessons from the Great Books podcast,

episode number 136

with our book today, a meditation

on business success from a most

unlikely author. We've covered a lot of different kinds

of books on this podcast. Everything from books focused

around, theology and biblical commentary, all the

way to books focused on philosophy and

the practicalities of living a meaningful life.

We've talked about everything from Jane Austen to Shakespeare, as

I said right there in the opening. And, of course, we tend to

focus on books that you might have fallen

asleep trying to read in high school,

most notably War and Peace or maybe something by another

wascally Russian. We've read a lot of difficult

books on this podcast. We've read a lot of engaging books on this podcast,

and we've even read books

that aren't that engaging and aren't that interesting, but we've managed to make

something out of them at the end. And Tom Libby,

our cohost, today, has been, on this

show for, gosh, quite a number of these episodes and has

added his own unique flavor and approach to

these, to these books. Some of which he has read before

we've delivered him the script, others of which he perused the Wikipedia

article before he showed up here, and he even he is willing to

admit that. But today today, we

have a very special treat for you. Today

well, today, we have a book by

Tom Libby. That's right. Tom Libby is now a published

author, and there's no better place for a published author, who's also

the cohost of this show, than, well, the Leadership Lessons

from the Great Books podcast. So today, in honor

of the publication of the interpretation of quotes for

business success by Tom Libby, I would like to welcome

to the podcast our cohost, Tom Libby. And,

we're gonna talk about the thoughts, the

ideas, the reasons, and the practical approaches for

leaders and the practical things that they can get from Tom Libby's

book, The Interpretation of Quotes for Business Success.

Welcome to the podcast, Tom. How are you doing today? And happy New Year. Oh,

yeah. For sure. Happy New Year. I totally forgot that January flipped,

flipped the page over there. To me

to me, the first of the month is the first of the month no matter

what month it is. So sometimes I don't even realize it's a totally new

year. Remember, remember I said Monday. What have you got for me? Every day

is Monday. Every day that ends in Y is Monday. And we've determined this before

we hit the record button on here. So oh, thank

you. Thank you for having me. I I actually you know, when I remember,

I remember the first time you asked me to come on to this

podcast, and I was I was baffled by how much we were able

to extrapolate from some of these, you know, some of these classic pieces of

literature. And then when you asked me to come on about my

book here, I was like, wait. There's no comparison. Like, my book is,

like, there's no way that this book should ever be in the same

breath as some of these books that we've talked about on, on on this

podcast. But I certainly do appreciate the opportunity to talk about a book that

I just finished up. Of course. Of course. Look.

I covered my book on the podcast, that I wrote a few years

ago now. I think it's 3 years ago now. Twelve Rules for Leaders, the

Foundation of Intentional Leadership. And my cowriter

there on that book, Bradley Madigan, came on, and we talked about the book.

We talked about how we came up with the book and ideas behind the book.

And, and so this is just one of the perks sort

of. Not sort of. It is one of the perks of being able to hang

around a guy like me. So, you know, I have this platform, and I can

put anybody on it that I want to. And so there you go. I wanna

put you on and, talk about the book. So, why don't we

do this? Typically, on the show, we open up with

either a, a, a long passage or

excerpt from the book, or a long quote, or we'll

open up with maybe a a core idea. So why don't

you tell us? Why don't we open up with, with this? So who was your

let's start with your favorite quote in the book from

your favorite person in the book and why that was your

your favorite selection there. Let's open up with that. And if you wanna read for

the book directly, you can. I think, some of us would love to hear the

dulcet tones of Tom Libby, reading his

own words. So here here here's a fun here's a fun

thing. Right? So here's a fun thing about I mean, this is a 100

sorry. This is a 300 pay or 280 page

book about quotes. So the the thing I find interesting is

I I had a favorite quote. I really did. I had a favorite quote until

I started writing this book, and then all of a sudden, the next quote, but

I like this one. Oh, but I like this. Oh, but this one's really good.

Oh, I like this. But this one impacts more. Like, it really did go through

that set that that series of, like so I

don't know if I could pick a favorite one. But what I will tell you

is the one that started it all. Let me I'll I'll I'll explain it this

way. Because the one that started it all is actually not in the book, and

I didn't realize it until it was until I finished the book.

So I I I'll tell you a quick story about it. I was Mhmm.

About I I had just, I had just taken my very first management

role in a in a company. It was my first day of work, and I

was driving the 45 minute drive to get there. It was my

commute. And I had graduated high

school, like, I I was literally 18 years old. So I had graduated high school

very, a short time before that, and I accepted the

position I was driving. Anyway, I look up at this billboard, and I see

this quote that that I read

about 5 minutes into the drive. And the remaining 40

minutes of the drive, not a single thing entered my mind except for

that quote. I was constantly trying to think, what is that supposed to mean? Why

do I why does that mean does that mean something different to me than somebody

else? Does it have all like, I literally went through this 40

minute dissertation in my own mind about this quote, and that was at

18 years old. So that was quite a long time ago. I'm not gonna tell

you how many years, but it was quite a long time ago. And so the

quote was now there's no

official attachment to a person because they can't prove one way

or another who actually said it, but they think it was Albert Einstein.

And it was the the quote was perception is greater than

reality. Okay. That that and it was literally on a billboard, and it

just said perception is greater than reality. And I forget there was a little tagline

thing underneath. It was it was some company that put it on there, but that

part I never remembered. It was just a quote. And I started thinking

that entire drive in And wouldn't you know

that that stupid quote impacted my 1st

day at work because I started taking in information

differently? Like, as people were saying things to me, I started thinking,

well, is that their reality or my reality? Is that is

like, there's a difference between a fact and an interpretation of a

fact, and there's a difference between what is real

and what is perceived to be real. So I started this whole thing

in my brain. And then as I started

leveraging that quote in my day to day life, I

started actually feeling like it was my life's purpose to make people

understand that there's always more than one way to look at something. And the fact

that you perceive something one way and I perceive something another does not

make one of us right and one of us wrong. It, like, it really and

it it impacted that one quote impacted my professional career,

my being a father, like, the way that I the way that I interact

with, you know, my my spouse. Like, it really started

impacting my whole life. And and and

the the the simplest version of this that I can give people and and I've

I know I've mentioned this to you more than once because you and I have

had similar conversations to this. But the simplest version of this, and if you don't

think I'm right, if you think that if you don't think that this quote matters,

or if you don't think I'm right, here's a very easy way to to

determine this. Haysan and I go into a room

with the one door, no windows, nothing in the

room. Just just blank room. The 2 of us go stand in the room. No

chairs. No. Nothing. Just the 2 of us stand in a room. And a

person opens the door and says, okay. Your hour is up. Why don't you come

on back? I look at Hae san and say,

holy crap. That was an hour? It felt like it was 5 minutes. And Hae

san goes, 5 minutes? I felt like we were in there all day. What

is the reality in that scenario? Is that an hour is an hour. It's 60

minutes no matter how you slice it or dice it. It's 60 minutes. But how

you perceive that hour is way more impactful to you than it

is to anybody else. So that one quote

literally started this whole thing multiple

decades ago. So as I

started as I started through my life, and I'm noticing that other people

have similar attachments to these quotes. Right? Mhmm.

Henry Ford, whether you think you can or you think you cannot, you're right. You

know, There's a there I mean, there's a plethora of them. And

and you you walk into an office building, you'll see them framed on

walls with no way of

understanding what that quote means to that company. It's just a quote on

a wall to a person walking in, but people who work there, that might be

their mantra. Right? Like, you you might be hired on the precipice of you

need to know and understand what that motto or what that quote means to this

company because it was said by Steve Jobs or it was said by, you

know, whomever. And but to a random person walking in, that

quote is just a framed quote on the wall. So Mhmm. Again so then

I started thinking, like, what do all these quotes mean to people? And and and

should I have an opinion about this? Can I can I can I actually make

this mean something to anybody? So that's what prompted the

book. I started collecting the thoughts of these quotes and

what it means to people and why it's important to people and and why do

we look up to certain people and why do we why are these quotes actually

framed on walls when, you know, you we mentioned a couple of people,

before we hit the record button here. You know, people like you know, there are

certain people that you can understand. Right? Mhmm. People like

Warren Buffett, Richard Branson, Jeff Bezos.

These guys who have made who have built multibillion

dollar organizations. If they have an opinion about business, a lot of

people will listen. Right? But then you also hear

actors and actresses and athletes that come out with these what they

think of as these profound comments, and people will start quoting them all over the

Internet because well, just because they're famous. It has nothing to do with whether they're

right or wrong or whether they're good or bad. Well, you know, Michael Jordan's famous.

Let's quote Michael Jordan. Now, by the way, just for the for the for the

peace of mind of the audience here, Michael Jordan is also a very savvy business

person. So I'm just gonna give him that too. There are a couple

of people, you know, Michael Jordan, Magic Johnson,

people in the basketball world. They are also very savvy business people. And there's a

couple others in, you know, from the athletic world. But but

the initial the initial impact of these

statements are simply because they're popular or they're they're you know, they

they have, like, you know, mass media. Take Taylor Swift, for

example. If Taylor Swift came out and said something that she could put in

a quotation box and and put it in on a on a mug,

do you don't think that would sell off the shelves? What do you like her

or not? Is it relevant? I I don't care whether you like Taylor Swift or

you like her music or not or anything. The fact is she has millions and

millions and millions of followers. If she put a quote on a

coffee mug and decided to sell it, she would make a $1,000,000.

So I think you probably should have put a Taylor Swift quote on the

front of your book. I mean, you could have gotten all the Swift used to

buy it. Dollars. Hang on. That that would that would be my suggestion. That's where

I'm going with this. You know? Yeah. Okay. So So if you

want an example of this, I can give you Yeah. But you you you can

ask you a question or 2 first. But if you want me to show you

an example of what I what what I'm we're talking about, I can. Why don't

why don't we do this? So show me an example of what you're talking about.

I do that a couple of I took a couple of of notes. There's something

that that triggered in my brain, and it's a story that

I was telling years ago, about quotes on walls.

A personal anecdote that happened to me, because there's another way that people

sort of deal with what they see on a wall. But,

but yeah. No. Why don't we why don't we why don't we focus on this

for just a little bit? So the actual quotes in the book, what what was

your as I said before, what was your favorite sort of quote, or what

what one really is impactful for you beyond the Albert Einstein

on the billboard quote when you were 18? Allegedly,

Albert Einstein. Yeah, allegedly. Because there I I don't know why.

I looked that up years after, and I couldn't find

a single source that was definitive on who actually said it. But Albert Einstein

is a common, associate to it.

So I don't I don't know if so that's part of my problem here. And

as I started explaining a few minutes ago, I'm not sure I can

give you the one or this or, like, the one a b or

whatever because there's so many of them in here. There's a 100 and I think

there's a 140 or a 142, actual quotes in

here, And they range from everything from, you know,

business people. But I segmented the business people into

modern business people like the Jeff Bezos and the and the Richard Branson's of the

world versus the, the let's just call

them the orig the OGs of the of the entrepreneurial war world, like the

Henry Ford's and the Harvey Firestones of the world.

And I was amazed at some of the quotes that came out of the old

leadership of businesses that actually still apply today if you really think about

it. Some of those like, Haysan and I use a com a a

phrase so often that I think it's now just embedded in in our

vernacular, which is the more things change, the more things stay the same. Right?

So when you look at a quote from Henry Ford in 1910

or 12 or something like that, and you read it and you go, well,

shoot. I could still use that today. Like, that that actually still applies or whatever.

Right? So I segmented the book into things like that. Right? So you have quotes

from, from business leaders from today, business leaders

from yesterday. I have, you know, athletes and

historical figures. There's

there's, entertainment, military leaders,

motivational speakers. Of course, how could you do about how could you do a book

a book about quotes and not include motivational speakers?

And then there's, you know, some authors in there. So there's about 8 or 9

9 or 9 different categories of things. So I think if I

segmented them out, I would have probably 1 or 2 favorites in each one of

those segments. But I'll I'll for the for the sake of your question

and for the the podcast, I will tell you one that that, from the

athletic, perspective and the reason I said Michael Jordan earlier.

There was a quote by Michael Jordan. This was I I

this had to have been, as he started his

entrepreneurial phase, this was not while he was playing basketball.

Although he was, you know, a 6 time NBA champion. I'm just letting everybody know

that that my vote for the greatest of all time is is Michael Jordan, not

anybody else, not to be named liberal. Anyway,

so

Not to not to put you off track, but I did see somebody tweeted the

other day or x'd or whatever it's called now,

that, he personally thought that

Djokovic and Steph Curry should be rated ahead of ranked ahead of

Kobe Bryant in the list of greatest basketball

players of all time. And I just thought Wait. Michael Jordan

did did or or No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. No. Some

random dude on Twitter. Oh, oh, oh, sorry. This is not this is not no.

Michael Jordan? No. Please. No. No. Some random dude on Twitter. I think some

former basketball player, Chandler, or something. Oh, yeah. And

and I was I was just I I just shook

my head because people are just saying things for attention now. They're just saying things

to get attention. That's just just you're just saying things so that people will look

at you and yell, and I'm just not gonna participate in that because that's just

stupid. That's the stupidest thing I've ever heard, Stupidest piece of analysis I've ever

heard. And I wanna go on record as saying, there's only 2

greatest guards ever in the history of the NBA. There was there was

Michael Jordan, and then there was Kobe Bryant. Kobe Bryant is your backup. That's

it. That's that's that's they're the 2 greatest two guards in the history of the

NBA. And if you want a 3rd off the bench, I would probably say,

oh, what the hell was his name? Bill

Russell? No. But Bill Russell wasn't a guard. Wasn't he a big guy? Wasn't he

a big I thought Bill Russell was a big Oh,

off the bench. Like, somebody Off the bench. Yeah. To rest Jordan and and and,

and Kobe, he's probably the guy I'm I'm taking as as my

3rd. You know what I mean? Yeah. Yeah. But that's about it. But you're right.

You're right. I I I would never argue that ever. Anyway

Anyway, go back. Michael Michael Jordan's quote. Go ahead. Yeah. So Michael Michael

Jordan, the biggest adventure you you can take is to

live the life of your dreams. So

I took that quote and I wrote and I so my my excerpt from the

book here is, I often joke with people saying entrepreneurs are the only

people I know who work 80 hours a week to avoid working

40. It's a humorous take, but there's a lot of truth in it.

Starting and running your own business is an adventure that demands hard work,

long hours, and a lot of dedication. If you've got dreams of owning your own

business, I say go for it. Just be ready to truly put in the effort.

The rewards can be incredible, but the journey isn't for the faint of heart.

Owning a business isn't owning a business isn't just a job. It's a lifestyle. The

hours are long. The challenges are constant, and the decisions

are are only yours to make. But that's also what makes it so rewarding.

You get to chase your dreams, create something from scratch, and enjoy the adventure of

building something that's truly your own. However, best advice

however sorry. The best advice is don't try to do it alone if you

can avoid it. Having partners or support system can make all the difference.

I have several partners, and honestly, I don't know what I'd do without them. Being

able to share the workload, bounce ideas off of each other, and combine our

expertise is invaluable. Running a business can be overwhelming at times, and

having people to share the burden with not only makes it

manageable, but also allows for better decision making and greater growth.

Entrepreneurship is a rewarding journey, but it's a lot more enjoyable and

sustainable when you've got the right people by your side. So if

you're dreaming of starting your own business, dive in head first, but remember to surround

yourself with partners, mentors, or a strong network to help you along the

way. You'll be better off. So, again,

if you were just walking into an office and you saw a company that had

this on the wall, the biggest adventure you can take is to live the life

of your dreams. How are you making that impactful

as you walk in that first day at work? Right? Like, is is the company

is this something up for decoration, or is it something that the company lives by

and they want you to, like, be a they they're gonna try to help you

be a better employee and they be better employers? How does that impact

you as you walk in the door? I found it, and then I just

basically turned it into if this is

your life dream, then then maybe your life dream is to own your own company.

But if it is, make sure you, like, make sure you think about this. It's

not always a dream. Hasan and I both have been on the

beginning stages of these start up companies. There can be

nightmares involved. Just remember, nightmares are dreams too. So

you gotta make sure that you're ready for them. Right? And and and be

make sure so that's the style in the in the book. If you are

happen to be reading this book, that is some of the stuff that I talk

about in the book is taking some of these quotes and

kinda leaning into them, right, and making sure that you you

interpret them and your perceived value of this quote is

impacting you. And if you're gonna use this quote, then make sure you're using

it, you know, to your hearts, to your hearts

feltness, not not just some random it it it shouldn't just be

a random quote on your wall, I guess, is the the point. Put some thought

into into which quotes, you know, matter to you. Well, it's

interesting because this ties into what you're saying. This ties

into my point that I was going to make,

earlier before you read that, before you read that quote from, from Michael Jordan, your

interpretation of it. So I I worked with a client

that is I won't say the name of them, but they are

now no longer in business. They went bankrupt. Found that out,

gosh, probably about 3 or 4 years ago. But early in

my, corporate training career, I worked at this

this this now bankrupt client. And every time I would walk into their

physical location to set up a training,

I would see quotes on the wall, multiple quotes actually from,

Thomas Edison, from the aforementioned Albert Einstein,

Albert Schweitzer, just line, you know, the the the quote wall that you

sometimes walk past inside of organizations. Right? For sure. Yeah.

And I would ask the security guard who

was always escorting me because it's always, like, going to, Fort Knox. You know? I

can't be trusted walking through there because I was going to somehow steal some

proprietary secret or something. And it was a

shipping and logistics company. Brilliant. If I wanted to

start a shipping and logistics company, I wouldn't have to steal your stuff. I could

probably figure it out on my own. That's always been my attitude.

And so we're walking through with the or I'm walking through with the security guard.

And one time, I asked the security guard on my way to to this

to deliver this training at this place. I asked the security

guard, so do you ever read these quotes on the wall? Like, do they ever,

like, do you ever read them? Do you ever does this ever like, does this

mean anything to you? And he looks at me, and he goes, I don't even

know what you're talking about. I don't see anything on the wall anymore.

And I thought in the context of sort of what I was doing with this

organization and the training that I was delivering, it kind of made sense

because the training that I was delivering was on accountability,

interestingly enough, and a lack of accountability inside the organization

inside of the culture. And that kinda went along with everything

that the security guard, was, was saying. But

at a deeper level, this is the level that I think you're getting

to with these quotes and with your thoughts on them.

We slap these words around, or we or we we

frame we

frame these words as iconic that come from people.

And what we don't realize is that

at a certain point, these iconic words

are devoid of or are are are so far away from

their original meaning that we have to imbue them with new meaning. And if we

don't consistently and and repeatedly

imbue these words with meaning,

they begin to be stale. Right? They begin to fall on

deaf ears. They become aphorisms or

even, weirdly enough, caricatures of what they were

originally meant to be.

And, of course, if if we don't refresh or renew these

words, sometimes, you know, they just they

fall off. Right? They fall off in our culture. They fall off in our society.

We talk about this with great books, you know. You

know, maybe probably about 3

or 4 generations ago, a lot of people would know

where a quote from a Shakespeare play

came from. They would have known that. They would have been classically educated or at

least moderately classically educated in the public school system, or

they would have at least had Shakespeare force fed to them. Now

most people know about Shakespeare, if they know about Shakespeare at all, from

a movie that started Leonardo DiCaprio, right, back in the

day. Yeah. And or Gwyneth

Paltrow. I'm sorry. It wasn't Leonardo DiCaprio. It was Gwyneth Paltrow. But Leo did do

Shakespeare as well. And I would say that

most modern people, postmodern people

between 18 and 34 in that age range probably don't

know Shakespeare at all. And I

saw and I and I saw a quote framed the other day

on a a social media platform that I shall not name,

in reference to the inauguration of our current now current

president. And the quote was

taken out of context from the Shakespeare play. And it was interesting

enough to play that we actually read on this podcast. So it's taken out of

context. And it's this out of context quote that's just framed on the

Internet, which is, of course, social media is, of course, our new wall of

text, right, in a building. And I know

people are doom scrolling past that. They're tying it to current events. They're going, yes,

that that check marks a box in my head for how I feel about this

particular moment, and then they're moving on. And they're doing literally, they're doing that analysis

inside of 10 milliseconds and moving on to the next doom

scroll thing. And so we have all these quotes and all these words and all

these aphorisms, but they're disconnected, right, and decontextualized. And

so what I think your book does, even in the

title, is it it

contextualizes or recontextualizes these quotes in a

way that allows us to sort of anchor ourselves and anchor the

meaning of them to something, which is which is critical

for to your point in the title even and and in what you were just

saying, business success. One other thing that

note I noted when I was looking through the book and reading it and looking

at the quotes and figuring out sort of how to talk about it today,

Unless I'm mistaken and I missed it, and I did see you had

doubles in some places, like, you quoted Jeff Bezos a couple of times. You

quoted, Tony Robbins a couple of times.

We had a couple quotes from to your point, Henry Ford, Harvey Firestone. You know,

you you you went back to the well a couple times there on a couple

of folks, which is fine. I noted that

you did not have any, unless I missed them, with

the exception of one person who I would not classify in this area. You

did not have any actors.

No. I did. You did? Okay. So I missed it. Okay. So I did miss

it. Okay. Because that was I I thought when you were talking about how you

had set it up, I was like, okay. Yeah. Jordan, Tony Robbins,

military guys. Let's see. Robert down

Robert Downey junior. Robert Downey junior. There we go. Hedburn,

Lucille Ball, Jonathan Winters, Walt

Disney. Yeah. There's a few of them in here. Well, Walt Disney, I

wouldn't class Walt Disney was an entrepreneur. I wouldn't classify him as an actor. Lucille

Ball was a That's your I well, I you know what I did is I

I categorized them as the entertainment business. Okay. Alright. So that's

that's probably yeah. That's probably yeah. Jonathan Winters,

I I believe he had an entrepreneurial bent, if I'm not mistaken.

Lucille Ball, most people don't know this. Desilu Productions,

She owned the right. Was hers. Right? I know.

And I believe they produced, Gunsmoke,

if I remember correctly. Desilu Productions produced that. But I

know for sure for sure they published the

original published, but they were the ones that were the production company or

they funded and supported, a young creative

named Gene Roddenberry who had an idea for a

show set in space. Lucille Ball if it wasn't for Lucille Ball, that

show would have never existed. I forgot about that.

All Star Trek. How how is it how is it every single conversation

we have, Haysan, eventually turns into film. I don't know how that

happens, but it does. Every single every single conversation we have

on or off the air, so to speak. Because

film is in the blood. It is it is the life.

It's part of the life.

Okay. So talks a little bit about the quotes in the book, why you

picked the quotes you picked, or at least why you picked the structure that you

picked. Let's let's I I do have a question about this. So,

the people that you picked. Right? We talked a little bit about those folks. Right?

You have a divided up into into different sort of areas. Right?

One person that jumped out to me, and I want you to talk a little

bit about him because we'd covered his book, the Dow, Jeet Kune

Do, on the podcast way back in the 1st season,

with, with my, MMA

instructor and former marine.

Yeah. Former marine. So I was just thinking as an ex marine till your till

your dead. Wanna hear from the marines anyway.

I don't feel those in my family. It's yeah. It's weird. But It's

weird. Well, it's the marine corps. There you go. There you go.

But, Josh Josh Poland,

we covered, on the podcast with him, this book. But,

talk a little bit about Bruce Lee, because you have a you have a particular

fascination with, with Bruce Lee. I I

I do. You know, and and it's so

I from my end, fascination started when I was very, very, very young. And I

don't for those of you who have not guessed my age, you probably will

at this point because if you remember, Saturday

afternoons was all about Kung Fu Theater and creature double

feature. Like, that was that was that was my entire

Saturday was waking up at 5 AM to watch, you know, to make

sure I watched certain cartoons that were on in the morning. I'd get

lunch, come back in time for, you know, Kung Fu there and creature.

I remember the first time I ever watched a Bruce Lee movie and

thinking to myself I mean, this this guy was

superhuman. And I I was thinking about the we go back

we're starting with the filming thing film again. As I started

thinking about special effects they used in movies and and TV shows, and

thinking there's no way this guy can do what he was doing on that screen.

That that has to be some sort of special effect. And

then as as I started learning more about him realizing

that so, again, for those of you don't know,

Bruce Lee's punch was so fast. They could

not film it in slow motion enough for you to see it.

Think about what I just said there. They filmed it in slow

motion, and you still couldn't see it. That's how fast

he was. And, again, to me, as a kid, I was thinking that's

inhuman. There's no way that's possible. Again, so

as I started, then I decided, I was like, well, if he could do it,

so can I, which, no? But anyway,

I I had that mentality. So I was like, I'm gonna go take

martial arts, and I'm gonna go I'm gonna go, you know, find a martial

arts person that can teach me his way. I I had

no interest in any other form of martial arts. I had no

interest in jujitsu or taekwondo

or, you know, or or a aketo or any of

I had no interest in any of them. So I had to go I it

took me I don't it took me forever to find the the person that could

teach me this because in my neighborhoods, it was taekwondo everywhere. Like, there was,

like, you or karate. You you know, there was a couple of ones that just

said karate on it, but there were there was

not the variety that we see today. Like, if you go in Google's in your

neighborhood, you could probably find just about every form of martial

arts. And I say just about because I'm sure there are some that I'm not

thinking of that we don't have here in the US. I I I I but

I would imagine dozens upon dozens of different

styles, forms, techniques that you can find online. When we were kids,

that didn't happen. You basically had judo because it was in the

Olympics. You had taekwondo because it was in the Olympics. I was

like, that's what they were training for. They were training people to be the next

generation of, you know, Olympic champion here in the US.

Anyway, as I found the right,

the right, Sifu, it was

it was really interesting to me that I

didn't learn a single kick, punch,

stance. There was nothing that they didn't teach me anything until

I deeply understood his philosophy.

It was more like a classroom setting for me in the in the in the

first like, it was months. I I don't remember the exact time frame I was

very young. Well, not very young. I was probably, like, 9. But that's not

very young. I should have memories at 9, but I'm just saying. I don't remember

if it was 3 months or 6 months or 7 month, whatever. I just remember

it was months that I literally sat there in the dojo, and I I

didn't get I didn't get to I felt like I didn't learn anything.

But the more it he they just browbeat

you into the fact that you need to understand who he was as a person,

what got him there, his philosophies, how he thinks, how

he his movements aren't going to make sense to you until you really

understand him as a person. So now fast forward

to today, when I see these movies made about his life and stuff like that,

I'm like, that's not exactly yeah. And then you

see interviews with his actual students talking about the movies and and

I go, yeah, that's what I thought too. Like Yeah. And I was never

his student, but I felt I felt so connected to him because the

the the person that I learned from was so

adamant that it was not about kicks and punches. It was about

philosophy, and it was about how you treated people. It It was it was it

was it was your interaction. It was your personal

interaction with everything, not not just your not

just how you how you punch a bag or how you get into a fight

and protect yourself or whatever that whatever you think martial arts is.

It he made it feel like

that martial arts was a it was

about your internal being and how your

internal being makes sense of the world, and how the

world interacts with you, and how you impact it both how how

it gets impacted both ways. Right? So Yep. The funny thing is

I probably could have filled this book with Bruce Lee quotes, and I

didn't on purpose because I knew I would just geek out over it and

not really not really pay attention to anybody else. So

I I promised myself I was only gonna put one. I was only gonna put

one in it, and I tried to make it the most business like I

could think of because some of the other some of the quotes that he talks

about, and if you listen to some of his philosophies, they're definitely

more self serving in in in the philosophical part

of it. It's like you it's it's about internalizing

things and how you how you do

or don't allow outside forces to impact your inside

feelings. Like, there's a lot of, like, that that that interaction.

So there was very few that I could look at and go, oh, I can

directly translate this into business. Right? Like, there was because it was more about

interpersonal. So there was one I found, and I I promised myself that I was

only going to use one. But yeah. Well, why why don't you go ahead and

why don't you go ahead and share that one with us? Why don't you go

ahead and, Bruce Lee was a very, very impactful person to me as at a

at a young at a very young and by the way, I still say to

this day that if he was if he never died in in 1974 or

73, sorry, that that this world I think this world would have been a different

place. I really honestly truly believe this world would have been a different place had

he lived, but we'll we'll never know. Yeah. There's a good there's a

good there's a good, there's a good start for a movie there, Haysan. The butterfly

effect. Do you remember that movie, the butterfly effect? Oh, yeah. Go back and save

Bruce Lee's life and just see how the world changes as we go. Anyway, alright.

So the quote the quote from Bruce Lee was,

the successful warrior is the average man with laser

like focus. Now do you wanna hear my thoughts on this, or do

you just wanna talk about the quote? Oh, absolutely. I wanna hear your thoughts on

this, and then then we can talk about the quote. So, as

as I just mentioned here, the quote the book reads,

first, I need to admit something here. I'm a huge Bruce Lee fan. I have

seen every movies made, every TV show he was in, and on and

most everything that was made to tell his story. I even took Jeet

Kune Do as a kid. Oh, and something I didn't put in here is, I,

I bought, first edition copy of that book by the way, and

read that about a 100 times. The, the, the, the, the, the, the, the, the,

the, the, I have the book, I have the book behind me in the, in

the, in the bookcase. Anyway, back to the book. That's

that said, I this is still sound advice from a business perspective.

I've been in sales and marketing consultant for well over a decade, and one of

the most common piece of advice I give to companies is to focus on their

ideal client profile. Focus on the most perfect customers with laser

like determination and understanding. If you can do that, marketing to them

is easier. Your ideal client profile is most likely your best weapon.

It's like a martial artist choosing between a sword or a bo staff. If

you're truly better with one over the other, it'll give you the best chance

of winning. If you focus on what your company does best and for the correct

target market, you'll be successful. You should minimize the

distractions and pay close attention to what helps you move the needle forward.

So, again, from a business perspective, I I looked at that

that, you know, success you

can be an average person. You can be an average company. You can be a

mediocre middle of the road. But if you define

success by customer acquisition, revenue, any of

those other things, and you have laser like focus on the

people that you should be doing business with, you can overcome a lot. You can

overcome a lot in your business by having that laser focus. So

that's my that was my thought on the quote. One of the things that

Bruce Lee really advocated

for, and I agree if he hadn't died in 74, I think the

entire history of

martial arts and entertainment in America would be would be totally different. We probably

wouldn't have had the the McAdojo phenomenon that we had in the 19

eighties and the 19 nineties, where literally every

every person with an idea of what a martial art could

be, you know, open up shop and

water down karate and water down taekwondo.

And I've seen this podcast before. I'm I'm a person with a background in taekwondo.

I'm currently doing, currently on a long grind in jujitsu.

I'm grinding my way towards a grinding my way towards a black belt in jujitsu,

with my my old behind. And

and all of that would have probably been would have probably been different.

But Bruce Lee cat because because of the kind of the kind of shadow that

Bruce Lee passed, upon just the world

of martial arts and combat, sports

and combat philosophy, not only in the,

in the in the east, but in the west and and particularly

through his Hollywood, his Hollywood efforts. So I agree with you.

Things would have been different, quite different. And don't get me wrong. I still

think he had a positive impact on some of that stuff. I mean, think about

it. Some of the some of the martial artists that we have today and and

we consider action stars, a lot of them actually

have real experience. I mean, Jet Li is a 3 time Wushu

champion. I mean, that guy Right. I would not wanna meet Jet Li in a

dark alley when he's mad at me. Like, you know what I mean? I'm sorry,

but that guy is incredible. Same thing with a couple others. Like, I

think people don't realize that there are there is some

cinematography that goes on, and there I I get that. But

there is some sense of, of authenticity

when you talk about some of these guys. Like, again, the, you know,

Donnie, was Donnie, Donnie Yo? Donnie Yen. Donnie Yen. Yeah.

Donnie Yen is very good. Like, Jason Statham, very

good. Like, people don't real that that guy comes across as a typical action

star like the like the Sylvester Stallones and the Arnold Swatznick of the

world. Not realizing this this guy can fight, man. Like, this guy is

real. Like, he's legit. Same thing Well, or or or

Wesley Skaggs or, you know yeah. You know

who surprised me in this world, though? Honest to god, I I and I never

would have thought it. And and you you I don't know if you know you've

gotta know this. Of all people, you know this. Dolph Lundgren.

Oh, yeah. Most people don't realize 2 things about Dolph Lundgren.

Number 1, the guy is freaking brilliant. He has advanced he

has advanced degrees. Like, this guy is not dumb, number 1. Number 2,

he was actually a fighter. Like, this guy fought for a living.

Yeah. He he's he's more than just he's more

than just a pretty face facing. Like, what was it? Rocky 4?

No. Yeah. Rocky 4. Sorry. Rocky 3 was,

was, the fight back to Clubber

Lane. Yeah. So it was not Yeah. Yeah. The Russian. Yeah. The the Russian. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. For Carl Weathers. Fragic.

Fragic. Fragic. I I loved Carl Weathers.

So I think I think, well, I think Bruce Lee would

have had a a huge, would have had a huge impact. Probably more so than

well, Karate Kid would have been a totally different phenomenon because that actually did set

up a whole lot of shenanigans and nonsense that happened later on. Through no fault

of the film's own, like, the film is just trying to be an entertaining film,

telling you to tell a story, and there's a whole bunch of domino effects that

happened after that. Yeah. Fun fun fact. Pat Morietta had no idea

what martial arts was until he did that movie. Yeah.

So there's that. And so there's that. Yeah. Then you look at the

karate kid version with, Jackie Chan and and Jaylen

Smith. Right. Jade sorry. Jaylen Smith. I was thinking Jaylen Jaylen Daniels with the Washington

Redskins. Sorry. Football's still on my brain too. Anyway, Jaylen,

you know, with Smith and and Jackie Chan, I think that's more

realistic as to what we would have seen in the first run if Bruce Lee

was still alive. Right? Like Yeah. Yeah. Whether yes, no, whatever. I don't know. But

we could debate it all. You know? Well, and that would have been well, and

and and if, again, if Bruce Lee had lived again, this is a counterfactual,

conversation here, kinda sort of thought here. But

Jackie Chan probably would not have been as

big a star as he was. He probably would have peaked a little bit

earlier and then declined a little bit quicker.

Speaking to the point about Jet Li, I don't know that Jet Li gets out

of China. I I I don't know because, you know, Bruce Li is

just that's a stranglehold. I mean, the older you get, the more of a stranglehold

you have on things. And, yeah, Jet Li would have still been Jet Li, but

who would have known it? Right? Or maybe maybe Bruce Lee would have

gone to the opposite direction, and I I kinda tend to think he would have

gone more this direction where he would have plucked out talent,

out of the east and brought it to Hollywood and said, you know, I'm

gonna put my thumbprint on you, and you're gonna come over with me.

Knowing what I know about his life, I think the latter there would have

absolutely have been his path. He he always looking for good talent

to put in his movies with him. And then Yeah. Like, think about it. Jackie

Chan was in one of his first movies. Yep. One of Jackie Chan's first

movies was was with Bruce Lee. So he and he talks about him in in

a one interview I found. I found an interview with Jackie Chan quite a long

time ago, probably 15 or 20 years ago or something like that. But he talks

about that experience with him. And I

I again, so I think to your point, I'm I think the latter. I

think Bruce Lee would have done more for the movie impact

of, in the in the showcasing of what martial

arts. But I think I would have liked I

would have appreciated it more if he

brought his philosophies into it. Like, as he started

getting a little bit older into his early thirties, because I think he died at

32, if I remember correctly, at 32. As he started getting a little bit older

in his late twenties and early thirties, the philosophy was more

important than the actual physical. Right? So it was

taking care of your physical body was important, and he never

downplays that, never downplays taking care of your physical body.

But but it was but as he started getting more and more into the philosophies

of it, I think we would have seen more of that in the movies. I

at least I would have liked to. I would have thought it was I would

I would have thought it was really important. Well, the big question, which always

the big counterfactual, which, again, we can never know. Right? This is all

speculation. But for me, the big counterfactual beyond the

movies or him plucking out talent or even his interactions with

Hollywood, Pacce Quentin Tarantino, and Once Upon a

Time in Hollywood, I think

Bruce Lee's biggest impact or biggest sort

of moment if he had lived would have been

his interaction with, with, UFC

and sort of how and and this is one of those untold stories. Like,

the not like, but similar to the untold

story of how we have switched, and I I've said this a couple of times

on the podcast, but how we've switched from an America in the United

States of America, we switched in the 19 sixties

as television became more popular. We switched from being a baseball

culture to being a football culture.

And the baseball culture you know, baseball is a game of individuals

pay played as a team, whereas football culture

is all team all the time. And if the quarterback screws up, we don't win

the game. That's a psychological

switch in leadership. It's a psychological switch in judgment. It's

a psychological switch in, in the

in the the direction of competency and merit. A whole

bunch of things go along with that, and that's reflected. We always talk about film

on this podcast to your point, but that's reflected in the types of

of, entertainment that people take advantage of.

And sports, for better or worse, is a form of

entertainment for many people, in this, in

this country. And so the switch from from more of a baseball mentality to more

of a football mentality is one of those unsung, unstated,

unanalyzed and unexamined sort of transitions in America. But I

think the other unexamined transition, and this one strikes me even more as

a person who's involved with the martial arts, is our switch from a

boxing culture to a UFC culture. And

look. I I'm not taking anything away from UFC folks.

They're athletes. I would never not say that they are athletes.

I would never not say that what they are doing is not hard or difficult

or that I could get in the ring and do it. I would never say

any of that. Maybe when I was 20, I might have thought that.

I have a completely different perspective 25 years later.

But I think the the move from

boxing as quote, unquote the sweet science, and I believe you have a Muhammad Ali

quote in there in your book too, from boxing as a

sweet science to the UFC as

unless we blunt about what the UFC is. I mean, let's be blunt indirect. It

is it is Greek cage fighting, and the only thing we're

missing is all those guys and women. Let's be let's

be direct about this. Being oiled up and naked and just, like,

doing the deed, right, on TV.

We we have we have transitioned, right,

from something that was ruled by

a sense of aristocratic elitism at the highest

levels even. And and Ali broke a lot of that. But up until

that point, there was still some of that. So some of that hanging around. And

even after Ali, there was some of that hanging around. The person who fully broke

all that was Mike Tyson. But, we we

moved from that in in a space of boxing psychologically in

this country to a space

of, okay, we're all just gonna get oiled up and we're all just gonna, like,

wrestle on the ground and punch each other in the face. I admit, I know

I'm minimizing it. But but, I mean, this is this is where this is where

we're at. I call it the train wreck effect. Right? Like, you know, you hear

people talk about, like, you can't drive by a train wreck without slowing

down and looking like you have to like, you have to watch. Like, you

Right. To me, even people who don't like UFC

will watch a fight or 2 if it's hyped up enough because, like, a train

wreck, you have to it it because you have to see what happens. You have

to see what what's next. What kind of bloodiness? What kind of arm is gonna

get broken? What kind of like, it's like the violence is, is addictive

almost. Right? And it's, like, we can watch the violence and not

be violent because we're we're we're we're allowing our violent

our violent, what's the word I'm thinking

of? Tendencies, instincts. Not tendencies.

Curiosities. Curiosities. Because I don't think everyone has a violent

tendency. But I think we have violent curiosities, which is why some people

love watching wildlife films that the lion catches the

zebra. And and some people like watching the the just the thrill of the

hunt, and the zebra gets away, and they get all exhilarated. Right? So

and I'm kinda weird because I like both. I I have no I have no

I have no, qualms about saying. But here but to your point though,

Hasan, here's the weird the weird part. I find

myself leaning more toward boxing now

because of some of that what you're talking about, because it really is just

violent to be violent. It's there's not that there's no skill to it. I'm

not again, to your point, I'm not suggesting these guys are not athletes and they're

not skillful, but the skill set is so different and the

strategies are so different because the strategies are more

the strategies are more about pain infliction and less

about tactical warfare, so to speak. Whereas

boxing is more about tactical warfare and

and mitigating your risk at the point of

attack where you can end the fight. Right? Like so, like, when you see that

glaze in the eye, can you get a knockout punch in there? You know? And

there are some people that are dangerous even being dazed, and you go closer, you

get dinged anyway, and you're both, you know anyway. But

but boxing but here's the funny part I find about the 2 sports.

So far, and I say so far because I'm sure it'll eventually happen.

So far, every UFC fighter that has gotten into a

boxing ring has lost. Oh,

yeah. Oh, yeah. So so to people who always have this

debate on which sport is more difficult, more

what whatever terminology you're gonna use. Who's a

better athlete? I I don't know. Whatever. Until a UFC fighter

can step into the ring and and box a 12 round championship

boxing bout and win, y'all just need to

stop. Alright? I'm just saying. And and this is coming from somebody who's in martial

arts too. Right? I so with you, Haysan. Listen. I I have no

delusions of thinking that I'm getting into any of those rings. And by the way,

even when I was 20, my sensei would have kicked my rear end if I

thought I'm going to go fight somebody on purpose. I would have been dead. He

would have killed me. But, anyway, so so even at even

at 20, I would have never thought to get in that ring. I would have

never ever thought it. So I'm not suggesting that I'm better than them by any

stretch of the imagination. I'm just saying that if you look at the

2 sets of athletes and you put them in the same ring together

now, all the UFC guys always say, we'll take a boxer and put them we'll

kill them in there in the octagon. Yeah. Well, no kidding. Because boxers don't

train in ground and pound, and they don't and they're not gonna learn that

in in 3 months before a fight. Whereas UFC

fighters work on boxing skills all the time.

Yeah. And yet, when given the opportunity to spend 6 months to actually train

in it, they still can't get up to speed with somebody who's been doing it

most of their life. Right? Like, that's Well and well, and at a at a

practical level. And then And we need to get off this. And we could yeah.

We could switch off for boxing talk here in just a second. I think we're

gonna Bruce sleeping don't definitely derail this. I told you this would happen, Nissan. I

told you that Bruce sleeping would derail us. Yeah. We abandoned half our

audience. It's fine. No. I think that,

and I've noticed this at at a practical level. And I'm no Joe Rogan

level. I'm not a Joe Rogan analysis guy, so please,

if you're gonna come for me, fine. Whatever. Correct my analysis.

But in looking at the striking capabilities of a UFC fighter, your

average UFC fighter and by the way, I think Bruce Lee would have been very

impactful in the same way the Gracies were impactful on the

UFC, one through maybe 5, maybe

even 1 through 10. But I think after UFC 10, there's a

market to your point turn towards

brutality and ground and pound. Right? There's a market turn in that

direction because, if it bleeds, it leads, and

you've gotta get ticket sales up. And Guy,

Royce Gracie, or or Hurion Gracie,

I'm sorry, Helion Gracie, or

or or any of the Gracie brothers. And it would have been interesting, by the

way. The Gracie brothers versus Bruce Lee. That would have been

interesting because I think, number 1, Bruce Lee would have learned jujitsu.

Number 2, he wouldn't have had any patience for the Gracie's. Like 0

patients, but they wouldn't have any zoo they would have had any patience for him

either. And I think

that generational gap between the 2 of them would have been exposed in any

UFC kind of engagement beyond just age. It

was just been a gap in philosophy. And who would have

won that? Who would have come out on top? Obviously, it's a counterfactual who can

say. Now last point, pounding right on the technique, on the

tactic. Most UFC fighters hell, and

this is a knock on most jujitsu fighters, do not

know how to strike. Weirdly

enough to your point for all of their training in striking,

ground game, kicking, where the emphasis is

placed most is on kicking, then ground

game, and maybe then punching. But the

punches pound for pound like, we just know this. The punches

pound for pound are not nearly as impactful or

nearly as powerful as those of a,

of a of a professional, a professional boxer. So,

look, we can we can to your point, we could do a whole just like

with film, we do a whole podcast episode on this. The leadership lessons from the

UFC. Leadership

lessons from Fight Club. That's what we should call it. There there you go. It's

right. Hey. That might actually be a good episode. We might actually do fight club.

I let I do like that book, and I do like the movie.

We would be violating the first rule, though. That that's true.

That's true. So, we're done now, and you have a good

day. Shortest podcast we've ever done. Yeah. Okay.

So surprises. Right? Were there any

surprises for you when you wrote this book?

Were you surprised by any either any people that you picked, any quotes that you

picked, or you surprised by any analysis that you gave, or that you

developed? Like, what were some surprises for you in or or maybe even putting the

book together? Because you actually don't talk about how books get put together. I talked

a little bit about it when when I self published my

book, 12 rules for leaders. Mhmm. But were there even were there

even any surprises that you discovered in, in putting

together, putting together the book or the people or your analysis or

or any of that? I think, I think the

easier the easiest one to answer of of all of that would be,

would be the the the the people that I selected. Right?

So when I first when I first started

again, this this came about this this has been,

10 years in the making. Right? So this I I I started

thinking about the first time I ever thought about doing this, it was originally thought

of as doing it as social media posts when, like, when we were really starting

to really move on the idea or the

concept of social selling and and, you know, and putting products and services on social

media to for so which was may plus or minus. It was about

10 years ago. I I know people can argue it was a little bit longer

than that. Whatever. It doesn't matter. But, anyway, so I started

coming up with, like, a I was, like, you know, let me come up with

a couple of really good business quotes. And I I went to the, you know,

the Richard Branson's of the world and the Jeff Bezos. Tony Robbins was probably one

of the first people that I I looked up when I started thinking about doing,

this. But I started it this all started really as social media

posts. And and how I selected the people

just became I'll just be honest.

It's it's started to become random. Like, I really it was ran it was

like it was like, wait. Like, because again, so when you think

of these quotes, the first thought or the

first idea or concept, like, you you think of what can

we use to motivate our people? Can we think of a a motivational quote?

We always use motivational quotes motivational quotes. So I'm thinking to myself,

okay. So Tony Robbins and, you know, a couple others that that

are in the motivational world, you know, the the the Brian Tracy's of the

world and Zig Ziglar and whoever. Right? But there's only so many

of them that you get really good quotes from before it starts getting to be

you're now, you're now basically peddling

Tony Robbins everywhere. Right? Like, you you just Right. You you start sounding like you're

a Tony Robbins reseller. So then I was

like, well, I was like, who else do we take motivation from? We probably get

motivation from athletes. Let me look up and see if any athletes have any, like,

famous quotes. So I just said, you know, famous quotes from athletes in the Google

search, and it popped up a couple. And then I was like,

interesting. Like, then I started to go, like, motivational quotes

from, you know, from business leaders or whatever. And that's it just

honestly, it just started I just started thinking, where do we

get our motivation from, and and where does that how do how do we

find these people? It opened up the doors to me quite

honestly to and I was thinking about, like,

some of the quotes that are in the book, by the way, are, like, if

you look up the the section about historical figures. Mhmm. I

when you talk about, like, favorites. Right? So I actually do have one of my

favorites in in the mode in the historical figure part.

And and then I go down these rabbit holes where I'll I'll see a quote

from somebody and I'll start I'll be like, oh, where did that quote come from?

How did that guy learn that? Where did that or girl. Sorry. Because there are

plenty of women in the book. But, you know, where where did that person learn

that? How did that person like, whatever. So one of the historical figures that I

can't George Washington Carver, that guy blew my mind

when I read about him. Like, I don't know if there's a if there's a

biography written about him, but if there is, you should probably cover on this on

this podcast at some point. Because the more and more I read about this guy,

the more impressed I was with him as a human being. It it is

and and it was so

I'm looking at George Washington Carver on on Amazon right now. Go ahead.

You're looking at, oh, to see if there's a book about him? To see if

there's a book about him. Yeah. So he he was born in

18/64, and he lived until 1943. Think of

the stuff that that man had seen in his lifetime. Like,

just just just that time frame and the fact that

he was able to go to college, get

advanced degrees, start he actually started a

college program, at I believe it was at

Tuskegee, University or something like that about

about agriculture. And and the guy was amazing. He was brilliant. And,

like and then so he his quote in the book I I won't read the

whole thing if you don't want me to. But the his quote in the book

was 99% of all failures come from people who have

a habit of making excuses. How is that not appropriate

today? Like like, I was just

I I read that, and I was like, we we could write a

book about that quote. I mean, seriously, we can write a book about that quote.

And even, like, I even started out in the in the book

on my thoughts about about the quote. I wrote, you know, first things first, what

an amazing guy. Like, I'd suggest if you ever have a chance to read his

biography to do so, I'm certain you'll be impressed by by his story too.

1 of the most resilient, sorry. His

story is one of resilience, the power of perspective, and a testament to

the strength of his own nature. Like, this guy was a force

and just went under the radar from most people most of his

life. But if you actually see his accomplishments, what they meant to the

agricultural world today, that they still actually use his

philosophies and his theories, it's incredible how

impactful this guy was that nobody even really knows about. Like, it's

Yeah. Everybody's like, the peanut guy? What? What? What are you talking about?

Exactly. People are like, oh, wait. George Washington Carver, was was he a real guy?

Like, did you know? Was I

somebody asked me when I brought him up one time. Somebody asked me. I was

like, oh, is that the guy that 12 years a slave was made out of?

Like, made no. No. This guy wasn't even alive at that point. Like, he

wasn't, like but he was born in 18/64, which means

there was a possibility that he technically was born a

slave. Probably didn't live his life as a slave very, you

know, obviously, because 19 18/64 was what it was abolished. But

Right. But there was a very there was a very high probability

that he was born into slavery and then released as a young

child, as a toddler even. But Mhmm. But if

you think about born into slavery and then in 1943, he

saw World War 2. Like, that to me is just blows

my mind. Like, that alone that alone, that that time frame

alone just boggles my mind. But then to think about all the stuff that he

accomplished and the things that that he did, it was incredible. Well, he was

part of that generation that also included folks like,

w e b Dubois, who we covered on this podcast,

Booker T Washington, whose book Up From Slavery, we we we

covered. Those those

men and women that came directly out of that

post slavery reconstruction era,

quite frankly, their attitude was this. From from

from from the poorest person to the W. E. B. Du

Bois types who had never been in slavery, who were up in, you know, up

in the northeast and were were historically freedmen,

their attitude to a person was,

oh, we're free. Let's just go

grab as much as we possibly can as fast as we can

possibly grab it before,

before we're before it's found out that it's all a joke or something like that

or whatever before we're going back. Right? Because it could be taken away from

us. And so they just worked ruthlessly

and pursued excellence ruthlessly,

in spite of to your to the to the point of the quote, in

spite, and and or not in spite of. And looked at everything. They pursued

ruthlessly excellence and looked at anything outside of that as mere

excuse making. Like Booker t Washington, he taught himself how to read.

Yeah. Right. And he's like, okay. I'm just gonna go teach myself how to read.

Like, why is that a problem? And this is a guy who had, like, literally

0 well, not literally, but almost zero schooling

from the age of 5 to something like 12 or 13. You

know? So he started from scratch at 13, and he's just like, yeah.

It's fine. Whatever. I'll just go figure it out. Like, it's fine. Why are we

what's the problem? Whereas in our era

He's a good example. He's a good example too of I I tell people this

is one of my again, one of my favorite thought

processes. I'm not suggesting it's a quote or anything, but, like Mhmm.

You don't need a school to be

educated. You don't need a college or a university

to consider yourself educated. Education is

the is the, is obtaining

information and learning learning from that information and

utilizing that information in a in a practical way. It has nothing to do

with what school you go to, what school you graduate from, what none

of that is relevant to the term educated.

Right. Right. Exactly. Yeah. And he just he's a very, very

good example of that. So when you look at

okay. So so Carver, you know, and how you

pick the people you picked. The the structure of the book, how did you set

it up? Talk talk us through that. What do we have to expect when we

open up the book? What are we gonna what are

we gonna see? So the structure of the book so, obviously, the table of contents

just tells you how they're categorized. Right? Mhmm. So and and that was the

simplest version for me. Because I was thinking, should I put

all the people in it? Should I take the the table of contents and actually

list out the people in the pages you can find them? And I was like,

never mind. I'm not doing that. Like, I just thought that would be too much

work for me, not necessarily for the reader. I actually think it would have benefited

the reader if I did it that way. But for me, it was

just less work. Anyway, so the table of contents just

categorizes them. Before each chapter, there's a

brief, a brief description of the chapter itself and a couple of my

thoughts about the people you're about to read about. You know? So for

example, if you're going to the section that is about entertainment,

and this is, chapter 4 in the, the entertainment business, there's a

there's basically a section that say, you know, again, I'll just read the first paragraph.

I'd like to preface this chapter by reminding you that the following quotes are from

people in the entertainment industry and should be taken as such. Even my

interpretations of the quotes might seem a bit, might seem like a bit

of a stretch, but these quotes have shown to be influential.

So, again, so from the entertainment business, we're talking about the people, you

know, the Walt Disney's of the world, the Audrey Hepburn's of the world, Jonathan

Winters, things like that. So we all those people that we find as

entertainers, I I try to get people in the mindset of what you're about to

read. It's but don't forget, these are actors and

actresses. These are people that, you know, you shouldn't be living your life

based on what they think of you. Okay? Like, these

are not people that have been in the trenches and, you know, have the

scrapes and bruises in their knees and elbows from, you know, from army crawling in

World War 2 or, you know, or people that have, you

know, lived on the streets for 3 months before they started their company and

now they're a billionaire. That so they've they've, like, they've been there, done that, and

they've lived through these are those are people that, like, when you take

information from those types of people, that hits

differently than somebody who's literally sitting on a on a on a on the

silver screen and saying, work harder. Go

fry. Like, you're telling me like, it might again,

one of my favorite things. When an athlete, a professional

athlete, and for those of you who have never done this, I'm gonna I'm gonna

suggest you go look up Aaron Donald of the of

the Washington I'm sorry, of the LA Rams. And you can

see a picture of him working out. By the way,

that man that you're looking at is about £275.

He's a giant ass human being that when you look at him on a

football field, you think he's bit one of the big fat linemen. Right? You

think he's one of the big fat linemen on the football field, you look at

him when he works out, this guy is shredded at 3 at

almost £300. And you're gonna give me workout advice?

Little old me that's a £185 and soaking wet,

and I the only thing ripped on me is my jeans. I look at

that image and you say, you're just gonna live more. You're just gonna work hard.

Go fry. Like, you make sure you understand where your advice is coming

from. So that's kind of the premise. So again, back to the

structure of the book. So I I put a pair I put a page like

that before every pair every, chapter so that you can understand

where my mindset is when I'm looking at these quotes from the incoming

chapters. The second thing that you'll see in the book is I give you a

little bit of I wouldn't say

history, but there's at least a little synopsis of who the person is if you've

never heard of them before. The George Washington Carver one's a good example.

If you've never heard of him, and you can you can look him up even

on his Wikipedia page is actually decent. I'm not saying I'm not suggesting

it's his biography, but it's decent. But even from his Wikipedia page, you find out

that he lived in 18/64 to to 1943. He was an American

agricultural scientist and inventor. He promoted alternative crops to

cotton and methods to prevent soil depletion, again, which are still being

used today, by the way. So this is, he

was one of the most prominent black scientists of the early 20th century

while I a professor at Tuskegee Institute. So I was right at West

Tuskegee. He developed techniques to improve all types of soils depleted

by, re by repeated planting of cotton. Under his leadership, the ex

the experiment station at Tuskegee published over 40 practical

bulletins for farmers, many of them written by him directly, which

included recipes. Many of them, were advice

specifically targeting poor farmers, including,

financial means, producing bigger crops, and preserving and and

preserving foods. The guy was amazing. So, like, I put little

things like that in the book for you so you understand who the person was,

why. And when you when you read the little excerpts about who

they are and then you read the quote, the quote makes a little more sense

to know kinda where they're coming from. And then Okay. I my hope

is that if you understand them a little bit more, the quote a little bit

more, then my my kinda insights into the quote

makes a little bit more sense to you. And that's essentially the entire book. That's

essentially the structure of the book. Okay. Okay. Cool. So easy

read. Like you said, it's about 286 pages, but easy read you could bend

about. You can select. You can, you can you could sample from it, but

you could also read it. You could also read it straight through.

Okay. So we're we're turning to the corner here. Wanna wrap up.

This has been a good conversation. I am I am,

excited and proud of Tom for for writing a book, for getting out

there and, and putting putting his his thoughts,

around these quotes and his interpretations, around

these quotes, for, for folks, like yourself who are listening

to the podcast and other readers as well.

I was interested to

see, other than other than Bruce Lee, a couple

of other folks jumped out at me. Richard Branson was one of the folks

that jumped out at me. Interestingly enough, I am 3 degrees. We talked about this

just before we hit, before we hit record. I'm 3 degrees separated

from Richard Branson. I don't know the man, but I could tap him on the

shoulder, I think. Maybe get a plane from him or something. I don't know.

Might get some some interesting Virgin Airlines chocolate. I don't know.

But, the other person that jumped out to me and

and you had a couple of quotes in here, and I was actually joking with

my daughter, this weekend, in a different kind of context

about this guy. And I was sort of doing a half

way sort of English accent.

Winston Churchill. And I'm I'm I'm

fascinated because and I wanna know why you picked

Churchill, and what your thoughts were behind Churchill.

And the reason why I'm fascinated with by Churchill is because he was a person

who was undeniably a man of contradictions.

He fought in World War 1. He was an old school British

imperialist and colonialist. He, did

not fundamentally believe that,

well, he was unreconstructed around race and

ethnicity in all of the ways that we would find to be

obnoxious today in today's society, like, a Churchill walking around in

today's society, he would be booted from polite society immediately.

Him and GK Chesterton would be on an island somewhere, and they would be have

their they would have their phones taken away from them so they could never tweet

or speak again. But he was

also with that being said, he was also a

brilliant marketer

for the British empire. He was a

brilliant philosopher of

what success actually means. And to Churchill's

credit and I think this is probably because of the darker sides of him that

he understood. By the way, he was also a painter, which people don't know about

that. He was a prolific writer, which people don't know about that.

But Churchill understood something about the the

motivating philosophy of man, and he understood it

enough to rally England during the time

of, and the British empire, but to rally England

to to not side with Hitler, during World War

2, but instead to to fight against

Hitler during World War 2. And we could deconstruct all that like we're doing everything

else in our current era and finding all the problems with him and chucking him

out on the, the trash bin of history, just like the British

chucked him out after they were done with World War 2. But

Churchill's quotes and the impact

of Winston Churchill still ring down

almost 90 years now distant

from World War 2. Why did you pick Churchill?

Talk about the Churchillian quotes in the book. And then I wanna ask you about,

leadership lessons that we should be getting from, from your book there. So talk a

little about Churchill. Alright. So before before I talk about him,

let let me just I'm gonna I'm not gonna read the, excerpts for I'm just

gonna read the the the quotes. Right? So there are 2 quotes here.

So Churchill said, the pessimist sees difficulty

in every opportunity. The optimist sees opportunity in every

difficulty. The second quote, success

is walking from failure to failure with no loss of enthusiasm.

Reading those two quotes, I I'll throw it right back at how

could I not put them in this book? If you think about quotes that

can help business people be more successful,

that that literally I don't even have to read anything else. Why would you not

put Churchill in this book? I mean, to your point to your point,

he had this he had this charisma,

this motivational charisma that was basically

unheard of at the time. Right? Mhmm. Like, you you couldn't I mean,

sure, we had Patton and and soldiers would run through walls for

Patton, but Patton wasn't moving a nation. Right? Like Oh, no.

Soldiers appreciated Patton because they looked at him as somebody that that he

Patton was the the, the the the the

boss that would never ask you to do something that he wouldn't do himself. Right?

Right. Yep. If he's asking you to run into that into that firing range, that's

because he's right there with you, or he's been there, done that.

Churchill was more like the guy sitting back going

the he was the cheerleader, the the the you can do it. I

I know you can do it. Have you done it? No. That's not it's not

about what I can do. It's about what I know you can do. Like, you

know what I mean? So he was he was basically a motivational speaker before the

motivational speaker thing even even happened. So Yeah. No.

That's true. So again, for this book, I ask you why how

could you do a book like this without putting Churchill in it? I don't think

a book like this could happen without having Churchill quotes in it. Yeah.

Yeah. Like I said, he he he is a he

was definitely he was definitely a colonialist. Like, he

believed in the imperial right to rule. Right? And yet

and which again creates tensions in our modern era. Right? But

to your point about quotes, I mean, there's one famous quote. I was this is

what I was joking with with my daughter about where he's at some party with

some woman. I can't remember what the context is. It was some

diplomatic party, and people will correct me on this when they hear

it. And, I think it was, some

diplomat's wife. And she said to him, you know, if

you were my husband, I would poison you or something to that effect. And

Churchill, without missing a beat, says back to

her, ma'am, if I were your husband, I would drink the poison.

Right? Or some variation of that.

Oh, didn't he say something like I would happily drink the poison or something? Yeah.

Like, he didn't. The man didn't miss. He did

not miss. He never missed. And the reason why

or rarely missed. And the reason why I think was because he understood to your

point about cheering from the back. He understood

and those those quotes as well. He understood something about human nature

at a at a very deep level, but then he also understood how to

communicate that in its simplest, most direct

manner and its most impactful manner

and weirdly enough at the tie at the appropriate time.

Right? So, his, you know, his his

his speeches, his proclamations, and, of course, he took advantage

of radio, which was a relatively new technology at the time

that allowed him and allowed his voice just like with Roosevelt,

allowed him to rouse a nation, out of their, out of their,

collective, their collective slumber. I do I do wanna read one

one part. Right? So in the in the quote, success is walking from

failure to failure with no loss of no loss of

enthusiasm. I I wrote, let's be transparent here. I don't know

what, the reference or what this quote is pertaining to, but I'm

hoping he wasn't speaking about military failures. I couldn't even imagine having

failure after failure, losing lives, and being enthusiastic about going into the next

battle. But that was Winston Churchill for you. Yeah. Oh, there you go.

Yeah. So, I mean, you

know, it it again, it's there's there's actually a a

third quote in here from him saying, success is never final, failure is never

fatal. It is courage that counts. So, like Yeah. To your point,

though, I I just think I think that that he was such

a he was a motivational speaker before it was a thing. I mean, let's just

put it that way. That's I I think that's why he's in this book. And

and I think I think leaders I think leaders

can look at his quotes, hopefully, take them into

context of the the the time frame that he's talking about World War

2, the most one one of the most horrific time frames of our of our

history. And he's just trying to keep the spirits

up of people who are fighting for all of our freedoms. And I say all

of ours because, you know, in the in the, in the words

of, was it was it Jeff Daniels in in,

the newsroom that that said, you know,

America is not the the freest country on the planet. There's 207

sovereign countries, a 180 of which are free countries.

They have elections. Like so I think all that started

with World War 2. Think about it. World War 2 really was the the catapult

that made all of the other countries in the world think, why can't we have

the same why can't we be why can't we have liberties as as citizens?

And I think Churchill was instrumental in making everybody feel like every citizen

mattered. So Yep. Yep.

Rounding a corner here as we close. We gotta wrap up here

today. Wanna thank Tom for coming on the podcast

as usual and talking about, talking about his book,

the interpretation of quotes for business success.

So from the book, what can leaders take and apply for

business success? Let's let's close with that. I think it goes

back to something you said earlier, where you were walking down the hallway

and you were seeing quotes from all these people, but the security guard had no

idea, not only how to how to use them or

what to what to think of them or he he forgot they were even there.

He walked by them so often that they weren't even there. So I I think

for for leaders, I think, number 1,

I hope they can take a nugget or 2 out of it and help them

succeed. I I hope that some of the things that I say in here will

resonate with them that they can actually, you know, they can

actually take some of these thoughts and and and just be better business people,

hopefully. The second part is, I hope it gives them some

forethought or or sorry. I hope it gives

them more, like, hesitation of just throwing one of

those quotes up on a wall. Make sure the quote means something to you. Make

sure that the people around you know what it means to you. Find

people that that are gonna work with you because of the quote. Like,

if if the if the quote is up on the wall, don't just put random

quotes on your wall. Let's start with that. Don't just throw don't don't just

throw random quotes up in a frame in a frame and and and just have

it there just because like, that is weird to me. I'm sure it's

weird to you. Like, I mean, when you describe walking down that hallway, I

was having I was starting to have palpitations going, what the hell? Why would somebody

ever do that? But whatever. But but if you're gonna walk into an

office or you're gonna have, my favorite too, Hasan, with,

I I'm sure you've seen them with these, these, virtual backgrounds.

Oh, yeah. People will put them in the virtual backgrounds and you go, oh, what's

that quote? And they're like, oh, it's something I found on Pinterest. Like,

are you kidding? Like, what is so you're just throwing it back there because

you you like you like the border? Or

Audrey Hepburn was my favorite actress, so I just put it up there because I

love her. Well, what does it say? Can you can you tell me what it

says without looking back there? It's for those of you who are watching

the video on this, he's on speaker. But, again,

I I I I know I'm going off on this tangent because

here's the here's the thing. Here's the most important thing that you can take away

from this podcast episode. Yes. Words matter.

The words words matter. The words that you use

to explain yourself, to express yourself, to under so that

people understand who you are, what you are, who your business is, what your business

does matters. Make them matter and make

them matter to not just you, but the people that are reading them. And if

they ask you questions about it, have answers. Have the answers as to

why this quote matters to you. Because you know what? I just did a book

of a 140 of these, a 140 something of these quotes, and

every single one of them mattered to me, which is why I wrote the excerpts.

Right? Like, why I wrote the the things. Because it

it it's not as simple as, oh, that's a cool quote. I like

that quote. Bruce Lee was my favorite human being of all time. I'm just gonna

use one of his quotes. I it it shouldn't be about that. It should be

something that resonates with you, that you can resonate with other people

over, that you can geek out over. I Hasan and I could talk about just

about any topic you want us to talk about. I'm guaranteeing you, we will find

some way, shape, or form to move that that conversation into movies. But,

anyway, that's but but that's because

we've understood movies have mattered to us as a

culture, as a history, as a as a progression. We've

watched not only that, we've seen things in movies start as

science fiction and end up as a reality. Like Right. Some scientist watched

a movie as a kid and went, I think I can build that, and they

do it. So Yep. Like, movies are impactful to

people. Words matter. The words that you use matter.

And I I I think the reason

this is even the most impactful. Again, I go back to that very first quote,

and why I didn't put it in this book is beyond me. I have no

idea why I didn't do that. I think it was I think it was selfish.

I think it was selfishness. I think I just wanted that quote to be mine.

And I didn't wanna tell everybody else what I thought about.

But and I didn't wanna put it in print, so that I could never take

it back. Because you can never take it back? Yeah. Or I can never say,

you took that out of context. Anyway, but

I I think I think because these words matter and and and

how you choose your words matter in every situation you can think

of. Your interaction with your children, your interaction with your spouse, your

interaction with your boss, your interaction with the IRS when they audit

you. Your words matter, and how you use them

matters. So what leaders what I what I hope

leaders get out of this book is don't just take a random quote, put it

on the wall, and hope people get it. Make sure there's some meaning and some

purpose behind what you're actually asking people to think about and do and

and use. And if they have a different interpretation than you do, that's not

necessarily a bad thing either. You can still you can still leverage

the successes of both of those interpretations to your advantage.

Words matter. And the words of Tom

Libby will be the words that we

the final thoughts that we have, on this podcast episode

today. We will have the links to where you can pick up the

interpretation of quotes for business success. It is available on Kindle.

You can also get a physical, paperback version

from Amazon. Tom, we'll have those links,

in the show notes below the player for this podcast

episode. So I encourage you to go out and pick up those pick up that

copy. Go ahead, Tom. If I could add one more question.

I I I would absolutely love to hear what you guys think. I'd love to

hear if you read some of my words on it. Your thoughts

on even my words. If you guys I I would love to hear what people

think about it. So if you do have the forethought to to look at it,

to read it, to pick up the Kindle, I would I would

absolutely welcome your version of the interpretation. And post

those reviews, on Amazon.com. Just search for Tom

Libby or Thomas Libby. I don't know which No. It's Tom. It's Tom. It's Tom?

Okay. Cool. Tom Libby. So we're putting it underneath there. So, go

ahead and search for that. Look for the interpretation of quotes for

business success and leave a review on Amazon.

Once again, I'd like to thank Tom Libby for coming on our show today.

And with that, well, we're out.